> everyone who worked there has a black mark on their CV
I hope this is hyperbole. Rank and file employees are not responsible for corporate policy or direction, especially in places like Oracle.
It really isn't. Oracle has had a terrible reputation since forever, and every ex-Sun engineer I've met has taken great pains to explain they did not join Oracle voluntarily.
It's kind of like working for a tobacco company or arms manufacturer in payroll or something: you're not directly responsible for killing millions of people, but by choosing to work there you're still kind of condoning it.
> arms manufacturer in payroll or something: you're not directly responsible for killing millions of people, but by choosing to work there you're still kind of condoning it.
It morbidly amuses me that this kind of argument can still be made given what's going on in Ukraine. Governments have militaries for a reason, and there's a reason Europe is now scrambling to re-arm itself.
Governments have militaries for many reasons. If you work at a US arms manufacturer, some of your output may indeed being going to defend Ukraine, but some of it is also going to the Israeli military in Gaza, the Saudi Arabian military in Yemen, and a long, long list of countries listed here:
See how the goalposts now move from "arms manufacturer in general" to "I don't agree with US foreign policy."
And even assuming that's true for the sake of argument, what? Lockheed Martin, Raytheon, et al. are just supposed to shut down for good the moment one politician makes a morally questionable decision? Life is not that black and white.
You're inventing your own goal posts here, since I didn't say anything of the sort.
To repeat: if you work for an arms manufacturer, you condone killing people. Hopefully it's because you think the weapons are killing enough Nazis/terrorists/bad guys to outweigh the occasional innocent civilian, but their blood is still on your hands.
I'm curious, does it end only at Oracle?
What about Google, Facebook & Microsoft. They do some things that are disliked by many. Should we consider that the engineers who work there are indirectly condoning the no-privacy, ad-infested dystopia that HN hates, and should they be penalized. I bet many of these companies and a lot of others use Oracle products and there by support them directly with money. If you know that your favorite website/product is built on top of Oracle database/products, will you stop using it?
If Oracle (or any other unpopular company) employees are really shunned, then that's only because rejecting them is a no-risk, no-cost, easy thing to do.
Some people absolutely do judge people who work at those companies, especially Facebook. Google used to have a halo but that's pretty tarnished now, while Microsoft under Satya seems to have pulled off the unlikely trick of redeeming its reputation.
> Should we consider that the engineers who work there are indirectly condoning the no-privacy, ad-infested dystopia that HN hates, and should they be penalized. > [..] then that's only because rejecting them is a no-risk, no-cost, easy thing to do.
Exactly as you say. It's less about enforcing ethical behaviour than getting safe revenge on what is perceived as an easy target. For example considering the rise of LLMs, people affiliated with google search are probably about to feel the full force of 10+ years of increasing frustration with declining quality, rather than being legendary high value hires. Unhirables that are completely ostracized? Of course not. But a black mark? Yes, probably.
You're also contributing to weapons that can be used to fight violent dictators like Putin when he invades yet another country (or the same one again).
I'll never understand the West's public aversion to military R&D and manufacturing. How do you people think WW2 was won? Nice words, trade deals and hookers? At some point diplomacy fails and you need to be able to do something about it.
Coincidentally, I posted an Ask HN on that same question (actually prompted by a post on a different company today), but it hasn't gotten upvoted yet:
Ask HN: Do you penalize hiring candidates from companies that do shady things? | 1 point by neilv 1 hour ago| 3 comments | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43538530
They're not responsible for the policy, but typically when you're thinking of a job at Oracle, you likely can have other options. At least if we're taking about software engineers and similar people. I was being recommended for a position by friends who moved there and I refused, because it's a shit company. The money is not worth it. It's the whole "contractors on Death Star" thing from Clerks.